Saeco Incanto Sirius

[JerseyGuy]

WOW

Those instructions are amazing in their detail and methodical precision.

One item that gets my attention is:

5. Measure - Use a stopwatch to monitor the time the pump starts to brew until the shot goes "blonde". The ideal time range for a single-shot is between 22 to 27 seconds. Note: The ideal time range doesn't include the few seconds of prebrewing/prefusion.

It seems that most posts about superautomatics indicate that the shot times run to around 15 seconds. What is the shot time that you have achieved? Also, what are you doing to change the shot time?

Bob

I have heard that superautomatics don't require the same lengths of time that others do. That being said, my machine is capable of 24 seconds for 1.5 oz of water when the SBS is turned fully clockwise. The way you change time is to adjust the SBS position. The further counterclockwise the shorter the pour.

For my current settings, SBS at 1:30, I am running about 19 seconds for 1.5 oz and the stream JUST starts to go blonde as the pour stops.

But the real test is in the taste and I am very happy with it.

 

[BearDenBob]

I've had my Saeco Incanto Sirius for a couple days now and have an issue.

I've maxed out all the settings (SBS full clockwise, finest grind, maximum dose (12g)) but I'm still only able to manage a draw that lasts for barely 20 seconds for a single espresso shot - no longer. Using the nominal "factory" settings, it was more like 8 seconds. This is way too fast for my liking.

Has anyone gotten this machine to go a full 30 seconds, and if so, I'd be interested in hearing what settings you're using.

Thanks,
Bob

 

[JerseyGuy]

I've had my Saeco Incanto Sirius for a couple days now and have an issue.

I've maxed out all the settings (SBS full clockwise, finest grind, maximum dose (12g)) but I'm still only able to manage a draw that lasts for barely 20 seconds for a single espresso shot - no longer. Using the nominal "factory" settings, it was more like 8 seconds. This is way too fast for my liking.

Has anyone gotten this machine to go a full 30 seconds, and if so, I'd be interested in hearing what settings you're using.

Thanks,
Bob

How much water are you pushing through? I am using:

PRE-SHOT - 1.5 oz blank shot to heat up the pathway
WATER ---- 1.5 oz
BEANS ----- 3 of 3 (12 g)
GRIND ----- 3 of 7 (where 1 is the finest grind)
SBS -------- 1:30 o'clock
HEAT ------- HI
PREBREW -- ON (LONG setting)
TIME -------- 22 sec (after prebrew from first drop to last)
TIME -------- 26 sec (max if SBS fully clockwise 3 PM, not finest grind, and this is too bitter for me).

BUT ... The length of time with superautomatics has been discussed elsewhere and comments have been made that the time isn't the same as other espresso machines and less time should be spent on time and more on tweaking thw settings for the best taste. What it comes down to is how does the shot taste. I am using the Cafe Fresco Ambrosia beans and can't be happier with the espressos I make.

 

[BearDenBob]

Thanks, Alex -

My settings:

WATER ---- 1.5 oz
BEANS ----- 3 of 3 (12 g)
GRIND ----- 1 of 7 (where 1 is the finest grind)
SBS -------- 3:00 O'Clock
HEAT ------- Medium
PREBREW -- ON (Normal, setting - tried long, none, made no diff)
TIME -------- <20 sec (after prebrew spurt from first drop to last)

The stream goes blond after about 10 seconds.

I've tried both Illy Medium and Starbucks Espresso..

I'm curious - when my machine "prebrews" an initial spurt of liquid comes out, followed by a 1 or 2 second delay..then the stream is steady. I'm timing from the beginning of the steady stream. Is this spurt normal?

Also, after each coffee, a considerable amount of liquid accumulates in the drip tray - where might this liquid be coming from?

Regards,
Bob

 

[JerseyGuy]

The stream goes blond after about 10 seconds.

I'm new to this so I'm not sure what "going blond" really means. With the Ambrosia beans It starts very dark for a very short period of time and then gets a little lighter and stays that same color for the entire pull, but never gets to "watery" as it does when I make an americano in the morning.

I've tried both Illy Medium and Starbucks Espresso..

I tried the Illy and just didn't like the flavor, but I ran the settings much as you did and couldn't get a good pull, it was never intense. Sorry I can't remember the time, that was before I started calibrating.

I'm curious - when my machine "prebrews" an initial spurt of liquid comes out, followed by a 1 or 2 second delay..then the stream is steady. I'm timing from the beginning of the steady stream. Is this spurt normal?

Yes, that is the way it works. I notice a really small amount of "clean" water (probably from the and then some brew. Then it waits, to prebrew, and then starts pouring. I haven't "dumped" this prebrew liquid, as I think the espresso that comes out is probably some of the intense flavor o the initial water.

Also, after each coffee, a considerable amount of liquid accumulates in the drip tray - where might this liquid be coming from??

One source is from the "Rinsing" setting (page 14 in the manual). The internal circuits are rinsed immediately after the warming-up phase.

The other source appears to be from after a shot is completed. After cleaning out the tray and dregs drawer I ran a blank shot. After I ran the shot there was water in the dregs drawer and in the tray.

 

[BearDenBob]

Thanks for all your help. I've decided to return this machine.

As of this morning, the grinder has ceased functioning. It spins and whirs - rather quickly - but doesn't actually grind beans and deliver anything - the beans just seem to sit on the surface and bounce around on the burrs. And voila, out comes piping hot water with a slight brown tinge.

I tried to see if somehow something was lodged in the burr, but there's nothing apparently stuck. I suspect this has been an intermittent problem all along for me, accounting for:

- quick draw times regardless of grind setting
- wildly inconsistent brew strength from shot to shot at identical settings
- the dregs drawer contents after having used the same settings for multiple shots would be of widely differing sizes and consistencies - from nicely formed and dry pucks, to outright sludge..

Bob

 

[MarkJames]

I've had a Magic Comfort Plus for about 2 years now and have been very satisified with it. It was a super-automatic replacement for a Unic Pony that I used for 5 years or more with Illy Pods.

I loved the coffee so much that I purchased the Incanto Sirius to replace the MC+ and took the MC+ to work (and am enjoying an American from it as I type, I might add )

I have a couple of criticisms of the Incanto, though, for those still sitting on the fence.

1 - if you try to use the water from the hot water dispenser to top up your americano you can forget it - your coffee will be too cold to be palatable. This was a problem with the MC+ as well. Calls to Saeco were met with no help as the temperature of water from this portion of the machine is not adjustable.

2 - You can only set it to dispense 2 shots at a time. My americanos are all triple shots. This leaves me trying to remember where I am in the shots department when I'm making one for both my wife and I. It would be nice if it could make more sequential coffees

3 - If it does not complete a coffee (runs out of water, dreg drawer full, runs out of beans) it errors out but if you weren't there watching you don't know if the shot was extracted first or not - this leaves me measuring volume dispensed to see how many I got before it errored out. It would be a nice improvement if it told you how many shots were extracted before the error msg lit up

4 - The dreg drawer is too darned small. This machine is CONSTANTLY requiring user intervention. My MC+ had a HUGE dreg drawer by comparison. My initial impression was that the water reservoir of the MC+ was larger than that of the Incanto Sirius but I poured one into the other and they're basically the same size (within an ounce or two).

5 - The dregs are quite wet - I'm not sure why this is... the MC+ left a much drier set of dregs and the brew group stayed much cleaner.

6 - The coffee bean holder is right smack in the middle of the top. My machine is mounted under an upper cabinet. Rotating the machine on it's lazy susan doesn't bring the bean holder into a position for easy filling. I routinely get beans on the cup warmer area.

I'm not sure if I would still spend the money to replace my MC+ with the Incanto. It's a much more elegant machine, to be sure, but it is also less 'skookum' - more plasticy. The 'touch display' is not really a touch display but an LCD display with the buttons hiding behind the screen.

I love the grinder on it - it's a dream compared to the jet engine noise of my MC+. I also love the adjustability. It just needs a little more ergonomics before I'll be as impressed as I wanted to be for a machine that cost me 2 grand Cdn.


Mark

 

[jason1466]

Excess of water in drip tray

I bought a Saeco V'Spresso 3 weeks ago, and was considering upgrading to the Incanto Sirius, but a dealer in Canada (thought it might be cheaper than $1500 from Williams-Sonoma) told me that it had so many leak problems that they were not going to sell them anymore. He stated that he had a 50% return ratio due to excess water filling the drip tray. I had noticed a good bit of water in my V'Spresso drip tray after about 4-6 cups, which I thought could be normal, but he said is not. Any ideas, observations, experience with this either on the Incanto or other Super Automatics?

TIA,
Jason

 

[wolftimj]

Incanto Sirius

I sure hope this thing doesn't start leaking. Just got the Sirius after my Barista Digital (Incanto Digital) starting leaking rapidly, Starbucks couldn't find a new one to replace it, word is they aren't going to sell them anymore. I guess it wasn't the brightest move on my part to buy essentially the same machine after that, but I just loved it once I got it dialed in. The Sirius works almost identically. The big differences I notice are;
1. The coffee is as stong on the medium settings as the old machine was when maxed on fineness and volume of grind.
2. The steam wand. I hope I can figure out how to use it better, to make creamy foam. So far, I hate it.
3. Bean hopper is much bigger.
4. Screen is cool, but doesn't tell me anything the old one didn't.
5. Charcoal filter in the tank is nice.
6. SBS seems to work well.

 

[wolftimj]

Panarello wand problems.. fixed!

The Panarello steam wand doesn't by many reports allow production of good micro-foam. I experienced this also. After taking the wand apart (simply pull off the Incanto), the design uses a double-walled wan with a small air inlet hole on the side near the wide open end. I filled the hole with high-temp epoxy, and whala... a straight steam wand that produces the creamiest micro-foam imaginable (or at least as good as my slightly lacking skill coul produce).

Ok, now I like this machine.

:grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:

 

[jason1466]

OK, I just got my Sirius from WS shipped free from a NY store that stocks them. When I open the outer shipping box, I notice that the Saeco box was obviously opened and resealed, and inside I see a noticably cleaned but signs of used machine. I saw drip marks on the tray, looks to be dried milk on the frother tip, and a good bit of caked in coffee grounds under the brew unit. However, the accessories were still machine stapled inside a foam bag which makes it look like a factory refurbished machine at worst. I phoned the store and the manager then phoned Saeco USA who told him that they do not sell refurbished machines. Although I could perhaps live with a refurbished machine for a little price reduction, the machine also has a half inch diameter damaged stainless steel mark on the front side edge near the frother. So it sounds like Saeco is going to pick this one up and send me a new one.

So the question is did anyone else notice a used looking machine and opened box when they bought their Sirius? I do know about the grinds due to testing, but my last Saeco machine had nothing of this level of use/testing from the box. It would be nice to know who if anyone is to blame for this... WS, Saeco USA, or Saeco factory? It does look like a nice machine... shame I can't use it yet

Thanks,
Jason

 

[wolftimj]

Sounds like Williams-Sonoma screwed up to me. They probably shipped you a returned unit, hopefully by accident. The grounds and water drips are normal even on a new unit that was never used. These machines are test at the factory with coffee and adjusted before shipping. There will the a label that says this somewhere in the machine (mine was in the bean hopper).
Paying top-dollar from Williams-Sonoma gives you the benefit of going through them for returns and such, that's what I'd do. They ususally will bend over backwards to help, hence their well earned reputation.
If you have any more problems with the next one, the Williams-Sonoma NorthPark in Dallas has several in stock, and they are very nice to deal with. Good luck.

 

[wallisj]

I've been using the incanto for about a month now and to be honest i am finding the SBS a little bit pointless or at least i am not using it correctly...

The beans i use are fresh roasted but maybe a couple of weeks old by the time i get round to using them all...

I find i always throw the first shot away either after steaming or first time since its either got rinse water in (yuch) or it seems to struggle on that first shot....from then on i do get nicely consistant shots, good crema and nice tasting but i haven't found the need to touch the SBS...all i have done is played around with the grind settings

Not a bad machine but am regretting buying it in a way.....didn't do my research enough i suppose....didn't think i could get good enough manual equipment for the money i spent.....

I know now that i could have good a lot of very good equipment for the £580/$1000 i spent and could have been in espresso nirvana by now

 

[MarkJames]

For those having trouble with their Incanto Sirius re: time of shot extraction i may have a solution.

My Incanto was expressing a 1.5 oz shot in about 9 seconds despite the finest grind setting and the sbs maxed. It tasted fine and had reasonable crema but I wanted a slower, fuller shot.

I don't advocate doing this and it probably voids your warranty but here's what I did.

First I removed the rubber plug from the grind adjustment knob. Down the middle of the shaft is a phillips screw which I removed. You'll see that the grind adjustment is really just a 'nut driver' of sorts with a little plastic tab to restrict fine->coarse grind. It does so by bumping into a restriction inside the upper housing. It's really pretty simple. The fineness of grind is dictated by the placement of a gear inside the unit. It's calibrated at the factory for coarsest and then finest is coarsest + the amount it's allowed to turn.

I used a torx screwdriver to remove the screws in the top of the unit (2 small ones), and then removed the screws on the back and behind the front cover. One of these screws holds a grounding wire - watch this one as there's a toothed washer there. This allows the top to come free - but be cautious as there's a ribbon cable inside you don't want to break.

Lift the top of the cabinet off. Inside you'll find a gear with a red or white mark on it. This is the top of the grinding burr system. The mark is where the factory set it as the coarsest grind. What you're gonna do is use the grind adjustment knob to give it a turn by HALF to ONE tooth on the gear. NO MORE. More will likely make the coarsest setting into a finest setting. Once you give it a slight turn put the whole thing back together. Your machine now has a coarsest setting that is finer than it was at first, and a finest setting that is likely too fine. Set the grind somewhere in the middle.

This sounds a bit complicated but it's really very easy. In fact, I think that if you are able to turn the grind with something other than the restricted grinding knob you can do it without even opening the machine.

I now have shots that are anywhere from 18-27 seconds with a beautiful crema on top!

Mark

 

[slugline]

Incanto Sirius

After comparing Jura models at WS I decided on the Incanto Sirius. Cosmetically it seemed so much better built with stainless body, etc.

So far it's starting to dial in pretty nice thru trial and error. My biggest concern is the puddle of water in dry drip try after a rinse cycle or brew?

I returned to WS and 2nd unit did the same thing? I guess this is normal?