Upper deck

[gsan]

Will a commercial espresso deliver superior tasting coffee vs a home edition version? If a commercial cost $35k, what will one get for this price? Bells and whistles or truly superior tasting joe? Do the most $$$ coffee makers deliver what they PR

 

[shadow745]

In a sense NO... main thing a commercial machine/grinder is designed/built for is high volume/quick recovery/long term reliability. For espresso if you can manipulate the water temperature, brew pressure and flow rate within a decent limit you can have fantastic espresso from most any machine made.

You will see some spending upwards of $10K on a home setup (maybe more), but it's more about the bells/whistles than actual pure function. Espresso is like most other things in life in that there will always be those that try to reinvent the wheel when there may not always be much if any real room for improvement. For some time now the focus has been on machines/grinders that will 'hopefully' allow the user to make the latest 'trendy' underdeveloped coffees more palatable. You will see mention of 'traditional' and 'modern' which sorta sums things up. Long story short, espresso for some is becoming far more complicated than it needs to be. I know exactly what gives me a superb end result and I look fwd to using it every single day. At the end of the day use what works for YOU!

 

[gsan]

In a sense NO... main thing a commercial machine/grinder is designed/built for is high volume/quick recovery/long term reliability. For espresso if you can manipulate the water temperature, brew pressure and flow rate within a decent limit you can have fantastic espresso from most any machine made.

You will see some spending upwards of $10K on a home setup (maybe more), but it's more about the bells/whistles than actual pure function. Espresso is like most other things in life in that there will always be those that try to reinvent the wheel when there may not always be much if any real room for improvement. For some time now the focus has been on machines/grinders that will 'hopefully' allow the user to make the latest 'trendy' underdeveloped coffees more palatable. You will see mention of 'traditional' and 'modern' which sorta sums things up. Long story short, espresso for some is becoming far more complicated than it needs to be. I know exactly what gives me a superb end result and I look fwd to using it every single day. At the end of the day use what works for YOU!

So a $35k slayer coffee machine aint gonna make better joe than delonghi or krups then? What about a million dollar coffee machine called javabot?

 

[shadow745]

So a $35k slayer coffee machine aint gonna make better joe than delonghi or krups then? What about a million dollar coffee machine called javabot?

I wouldn't consider anything on the lowest tier as espresso capable to begin with. Too many marketing crutches more for convenience than performance.

Never used a Slayer, but I don't buy into the 'modern' fad as necessary. I have used quite a few different machines for home and commercial and get exactly what I need/expect from a simple rock solid beast of a machine. I will never buy into flow control, preinfusion, etc as well as adding more variables just adds more steps to dialing things in.

Any fool that would rely on a bot to do espresso doesn't deserve proper espresso to begin with. Beyond a decent level of equipment the excess spending is clearly diminishing returns. Browse various forums and look at the higher tier machines/grinders used a few months to maybe a year then up for sale. So many overspend thinking it must be better then end up with a costly rude awakening.

FWIW I take the same approach to roasting. You have some claiming you just have to spend big, use software, etc. to get great/consistent batches. I gladly call B.S. on that as I built my setup to give total control all done by me on the fly, no software, etc. I roast outdoors in temps ranging from 15-90 degrees F year round with different coffees. It is never totally about the equipment, but how you choose to maximize it. After all these yrs I still look fwd to roasting every batch and consuming every extraction as it never gets boring.

 

[gsan]

I wouldn't consider anything on the lowest tier as espresso capable to begin with. Too many marketing crutches more for convenience than performance.

Never used a Slayer, but I don't buy into the 'modern' fad as necessary. I have used quite a few different machines for home and commercial and get exactly what I need/expect from a simple rock solid beast of a machine. I will never buy into flow control, preinfusion, etc as well as adding more variables just adds more steps to dialing things in.

Any fool that would rely on a bot to do espresso doesn't deserve proper espresso to begin with. Beyond a decent level of equipment the excess spending is clearly diminishing returns. Browse various forums and look at the higher tier machines/grinders used a few months to maybe a year then up for sale. So many overspend thinking it must be better then end up with a costly rude awakening.

FWIW I take the same approach to roasting. You have some claiming you just have to spend big, use software, etc. to get great/consistent batches. I gladly call B.S. on that as I built my setup to give total control all done by me on the fly, no software, etc. I roast outdoors in temps ranging from 15-90 degrees F year round with different coffees. It is never totally about the equipment, but how you choose to maximize it. After all these yrs I still look fwd to roasting every batch and consuming every extraction as it never gets boring.

Then what do you suggest for people who want the FINNESSE of coffee if its coffee with cream or milk then? The most snickety consumers... the most fuzzy and demanding coffee lovers who want GOURMET tasting coffee... what kind of $$$ coffee machine can deliver this kind of coffee heaven coffee?

 

[shadow745]

Simply tell them to figure it out for themselves as people shouldn't rely on others to suggest what they 'should' like or make use of. FAR too often people will ask (on all types of forums) what's the best when 'best' doesn't exist. We all have different expectations, levels of experience, that sort of thing. At the end of the day people should try what they think might work for them and go from there and just not rely solely on advice from others. I have found exactly what works for me thru LOTS of trial and error as that's clearly the only way to get to that point.

I will add one more thing though... instead of focusing primarily on equipment, the main focus should be on the coffee itself as the equipment used to create the end result can only do so much. Of course that's not to say that super costly/'fancy' coffees are mandatory as it goes far beyond just cost, as with most things in life.

 

[gsan]

Simply tell them to figure it out for themselves as people shouldn't rely on others to suggest what they 'should' like or make use of. FAR too often people will ask (on all types of forums) what's the best when 'best' doesn't exist. We all have different expectations, levels of experience, that sort of thing. At the end of the day people should try what they think might work for them and go from there and just not rely solely on advice from others. I have found exactly what works for me thru LOTS of trial and error as that's clearly the only way to get to that point.

I will add one more thing though... instead of focusing primarily on equipment, the main focus should be on the coffee itself as the equipment used to create the end result can only do so much. Of course that's not to say that super costly/'fancy' coffees are mandatory as it goes far beyond just cost, as with most things in life.

So if moneys not an object, what kind of coffee machine should i buy if i want really great tasting gourmet coffee that comes mixed with cream or milk then? Delonghi, krups, ect...???