VBM vs Londinium

[DanFran]

Hello there,

I live in the north of England and am looking to open my own cafe. I’m considering two machines, the VBM Replica Pistone 2 and the Londinium 2.
I’d love hear about everyone’s experiences with these machines and would like to know which you’d pick and why.

Cheers

 

[Seb]

I had a Londinium L2 and it’s a nice simple machine. PI at line pressure which is nice, all panels are very easy to remove without any tools so good thing for maintenance, the group is also easy to maintain and good and fast service from Reiss. However i can’t talk about the VBM, i now use a La Pavoni Diamante that i find much more lovely looking but more complex to have access to the inside of the machine.

 

[DanFran]

Thanks Seb for you reply. I was also considering the La Pavoni, either Diamante or Vasari. Am I right in thinking the difference between the Diamante and Vasari are looks and the fact the Diamante is dual fuel as standard? Do you miss the Londinium?
If you were me, starting a new business, which would you go for, Londinium or La Pavoni?

 

[Seb]

I much prefer the look of the Diamante but if both where the same price i think i would go for the L2. If you aim for perfect microfoam, the L2 is perfect out of the box while you need to play with steam tips to get as good microfoam quality with the Diamante. Look is different but the group could be different also, the Diamante by default has two springs but i asked them for a single spring instead (i hate dual spring, i have a Salvatore at home with dual spring and this give too much initial pressure, up to 11 bar!). The single spring will give about 8 bar initial pressure which i find perfect. And yes the Diamante is dual fuel, handy if you need it only. In conclusion if look is not important the boxy SS shape of an L2 is easier to work with (for maintenance) and the steaming is very very good with the stock steam tip. For latte art it is crucial, i am struggling with my Diamante to find the right steam tip to work, i can’t install the tip of a Londinium, not the exact same thread. It’s ok but not perfect and need attention while steaming compare to the L2.

 

[Seb]

Also the Diamante does the PI at the boiler pressure (around 1.2 bar) while the L2 is a cold fed machine so it does it at your cold water line pressure typically 3-4bar. This mean you can grind a bit finer, get better results mostly from light roast and get a bit more body and TDS number from your shots.

 

[DanFran]

Seb, that’s some amazing info, I can’t thank you enough. The Londinium definitely sounds perfect for me. There’s not a thing you mentioned that doesn’t sound spot on, especially with regards to boiler and group pressure.
I thank you for your time, let’s hope someone can enlighten us about the VBM.

 

[Seb]

I took a look at the VBM Replica Pistone and it’s a beautiful machine. Group seem to be exactly the same as the Londinium (the one on my La Pavoni is different). So i would guess that this group is made by Condor and with a single spring too. It’s a thermosyphon also like the Londinium. Really nice machine. Go with pricing and service at this point.