Tips for a newcomer?

[ensoluna]

PinkRose,

As it is something we do not do, we are not refusing anything.
We don't have any bulk grinders. Everything is brewed by the cup.

If someone wants to use coffee of our caliber, they will invest in a grinder. People who want pre-ground coffee really aren't interested in buying these kinds of coffees. Great coffee, like great food, is not a convenience. It takes care and time to prepare.

it seems like Mr. Piquet has "Great coffee" which isn't for everyone. I am always in an hunt for great coffee and since Hector Gonzalez and I would love to cup the "great coffee" from Mr. Piquet, we would appreciate it if Mr. Piquet can advise me on his coffee information and where i can get them. First, please let me know what kind of coffee he has, what are the characteristics, origin of farm, how it was milled and processed along with cupping charts. that will help to compare our evaluation with Mr. Piquet's. I am not very much of a cupper, but Hector certainly is and I am sure that he can give all of our forum members the fair evaluation report. (once i get it from Hector, i will post it here)

BTW, on the contrary to Mr. Piquet's belief "Great coffee, like great food, is not a convenience", I believe that Great coffee should be a convenience to everyone.
Everyone has the right to enjoy the great coffee and the people who has "great coffee" should go out of their ways to help people to enjoy their great coffees.

I am not saying that what Mr. Piquet believes is wrong. It is a personal opinion and we all have the right to our own opinions.

however, if you ask me, Being a Coffee Expert is not thinking less of yourself, but it is thinking of yourself less.

PS: Hector Gonzalez is one of our company employee and he won 2010 World Cup Tasters Championship in London UK, so I am certain that he can evaluate Mr. Piquet's coffee better than a lot of people.

Guatemala's Hector Gonzalez becomes the new World Cup Tasters Champion

Hector Gonzalez

 

[John P]

ensoluna,

As a business, not only it is a sound decision, it is the only decision if you are espousing quality. If you are not, then that's a different paradigm.

David Schomer at Espresso Vivace (who we modeled our concept after when we opened) has been doing whole bean only for over 20 years, and it certainly has worked out well for him. It's about service excellence which is a much higher level of service commitment than the poorly defined term "customer service". Like Schomer, we have solidly build our reputation on quality, principles, and integrity to a point where those aspects of what we do are unquestionable.

It's about telling people what you DO do and why you do it.

 

[John P]

ensoluna,

we are a small micro-roaster and everything we roast is seasonal and small batch so throughout the year I may offer 70-80 different coffees. I roast about 3 times a week at our shop and the coffees are constantly changing. We source all of our green through a Specialty Coffee broker in California who's been doing it for about 30 years. It's just my job not to ruin the fantastic coffee everyone before me has worked so hard to grow, harvest, mill, cup, import, etc., etc.

We only sell our coffee at our shop or by subscription. You are always welcome to come and visit. I look forward to making coffee or espresso for new people.

 

[peterjschmidt]

BTW, on the contrary to Mr. Piquet's belief "Great coffee, like great food, is not a convenience", I believe that Great coffee should be a convenience to everyone.
Everyone has the right to enjoy the great coffee and the people who has "great coffee" should go out of their ways to help people to enjoy their great coffees.

But... if that convenience you feel everyone is entitled to includes buying ground coffee, then they are no longer buying great coffee. You want the best of both worlds, which is impossible. Great and ground, when it comes to coffee, are mutually exclusive.

 

[ensoluna]

But... if that convenience you feel everyone is entitled to includes buying ground coffee, then they are no longer buying great coffee. You want the best of both worlds, which is impossible. Great and ground, when it comes to coffee, are mutually exclusive.

I believe that everyone is entitled to buy whatever they want or need. On the other hand, as someone said, if that some one can roast fresh green bean right now, grind it after 24 hours later on and then immediately make espresso or Chemex to drink it, that would be "coffee utopia".

however, i do not expect someone who still enjoys "Starbucks", "instant coffee" to jump right into "coffee utopia". I do not think that is possible. We can let them know what is available, however, i truly believe they are not ready nor understand the procedures. it will take time.

Also, Ground coffee can not be great as freshly roasted and grind coffee, right before consume it. However, I guess we have to compromise it somewhere. Even very known roasters such as intelligentsia and colombe are offering ground coffees as their buying options. (actually those guys offer several different types of ground coffees which helps novices to understand and try out different types of coffees).

Peter, I am not arguing with anyone about the "great coffee". Perhaps, to you and John, Great coffee means "the great coffee". there is nothing else.
But, for regular people who just joined this forums or do not know much about coffee but willing to learn.... and sometimes that includes me also, we certainly would like to have some options and being educated without being chastened.

 

[peterjschmidt]

You are right, that everybody has their own paradigm for what great coffee is... and from someone who has turned passion for coffee into a pursuit that has met and matched every obstacle, it was never meant to be a chastening, rather an exhortation to 'come up higher'.

Back to the purpose of the thread, I simply see a world of difference between the person described above, someone who is in the coffee trade because they love coffee and are driven by excellence, and someone who realizes there's money to be made in the coffee industry.

 

[ensoluna]

You are right, that everybody has their own paradigm for what great coffee is... and from someone who has turned passion for coffee into a pursuit that has met and matched every obstacle, it was never meant to be a chastening, rather an exhortation to 'come up higher'.

Back to the purpose of the thread, I simply see a world of difference between the person described above, someone who is in the coffee trade because they love coffee and are driven by excellence, and someone who realizes there's money to be made in the coffee industry.

Finally...... you said it perfectly.
I absolutely agree with what you said.
thank you Peter.

 

[eldub]

John: Who are you buying your beans from? You said California so I'm guessing Royal Coffee. We do business with them and Cafe Imports in Minneapolis, mainly. Hpwever, we're always looking for new sources of top shelf beans.

This is just like the wine industry, imo. Some folks are happy with jug wine and others want something a bit more pricey.

A business neighbor recently visited our shop and asked me when I planned on putting our beans on sale. I told her "never." When she told me she couldn't afford (didn't want to pay?) $14/$16 for a pound of freshly roasted beans, I told her that I understood her concern and that our coffee simply wasn't for everyone. No crime in that, imo.

I'll never be the biggest roaster in town and we'll never be able to compete with the big boys on price. But I can offer the best beans in the metro area. And that's the niche we're after.

 

[John P]

O.P.

Sorry your thread has been hijacked. I hope some value is found herein.

ensoluna,

It's nearly impossible to maintain a certain level of quality once you get past 3 stores. What Intelligentsia does at their size is remarkable, but they are a different animal. We are small... intentionally, and fully focused on an artisan level in what we do. Think Morton's Steakhouse compared to Sukiyabashi Jiro.

eldub,

No, we don't use Royal. Too big. Not right for us.

As far as your business neighbor, it's not for everyone, and nor should we expect, or want, it to be.
$14-$16 per pound... What's her deal, anyways. She wouldn't like us either, the lowest price we do is $18 per 312g. (a little less than 12 oz.).

While everyone is working so hard to become bigger, we do our best to become smaller and more focused.

 

[PinkRose]

A business neighbor recently visited our shop and asked me when I planned on putting our beans on sale. I told her "never." When she told me she couldn't afford (didn't want to pay?) $14/$16 for a pound of freshly roasted beans, I told her that I understood her concern and that our coffee simply wasn't for everyone. No crime in that, imo.

Since she's a business neighbor, it would be "neighborly" if you offered her a bit of a discount. The couple of dollars that she saves, as she enjoys your freshly roasted coffee, may result in her making recommendations to her customers. She's already shown an interest. Some people are very frugal, and it's hard for them to take the leap. If the price is stopping her from making a purchase, maybe a discount will entice her to give it a try. Just let her know you're doing it especially for her, so she doesn't blab to all of the neighbors.

 

[CoffeeJunky]

To All ,
It is amazing to see what others are doing and stride to be.
My passion for coffee grew bigger and more organized since i joined this forum.

My take on coffee is little different from John.
I love coffee and I am sure if I ever get to try John's coffee, I might even shed a tear or two for joy.
But we are living in the a society 90 percent of the people still think Starbucks serves darn good coffee.
And I am in coffee business to make living and support my employes and their family as well as mine.

I believe most of the people are drinking pretty bad coffee for years and I love to help the better their cup but not perfect cup.
I also believe what I consider great might not be great for anothers.

I remember when Budweiser advertised their beer as "bud" and Miller advertized their beer " We don't want to be your "bud" but we just want to be your beer"

I know John is trying give their customer not just cup of coffee but an experience. And I just want to sell a cup of coffee they can drink everyday......

 

[Bardo]

And we need both types of people in order to have a healthy sub-culture surrounding coffee. We also need critics and zealots and doubters, of which there are plenty.

 

[eldub]

Rose: I have considered your suggestion awhile back and am afraid she would have no interest unless I give her a wholesale price, and I'm just not sure I want to go there.

 

[John P]

Bardo,

Agreed.

eldub,

I'm with you. I wouldn't offer any discount unless she's someone who brings you lots of business. She obviously doesn't see the value in what you offer.

 

[WatVentu]

thank you for all the good feedback on this thread.