Accademia Gaggi vs Saeco Xelsis

[h45e]

Hi Guys,
I know that Super Automatics are bad and should be banned for life, but I would like one because in the morning I dont feel like standing at the counter half awake making my coffee, also when my friends are around I want to be entertaining and not trying to make coffee's for everyone.

Now my question is which one is more quiet and which on is better?\

Thanks
Anthony

 

[Randy G.]

In either case, that is a lot of money to spend on machines that, as a class, are expensive, make marginally good espresso, and are very complicated (and thus, less dependable and more expensive to fix).

Look into their owners manuals and see if there is a difference between them in terms of owner repair and such. Can you access the grinder burrs and/or remove them for cleaning, as an example? Also, research local service centers as well as getting an extended factory warranty. Shipping one of these for repair can be expensive.

Also consider the Jura Impressa XS90 One Touch (or one of the other high-end Jura machines). This one is in this price range, and the Jura machines, in general, are considered very good.

There are videos HERE which may help. a little.. I don't think they really know how to set the machine sup, because if those shots came out of my machine I would dump them in the sink. In the middle video they tear into one and sort of watch it work. LOTS of plastic parts!

 

[h45e]

www(dot)youtube(dot)com/watch?v=nGPVYjIMOQY

Have a look at this, shows the unboxing etc.

 

[alsterling]

There is a compulsion, when one discovers the concept of "making espresso drinks at home", that drives people to super-automatic machines. Having been there, I remember that compulsion well. It happened at the outset of my specialty coffee life, and only lasted two weeks. I returned the machine, got a full refund, and bought my first heat exchanger machine, the Expobar.

My purchase of the Gaggia Synchrony, I believe that was the model, was driven by the thought that I could get a machine that would "do it all for me." I'd have real espresso at home, and I'd be able to make cappuccinos and lattes, as good as the coffee shop. (which was true if compared to the horrible product I'd purchased over the years.) As I experienced it, I was merely avoiding all of the information that was given to me about coffee beans, roasting, grinders, and proper brewing. I figured that if I paid over $1k, certainly the machine would make a great espresso extraction; done deal. And the machine came with a "magic wand" that would steam and froth my milk to perfection. That avoided learning about steaming and frothing. But as anyone who's been there will tell you, this is just not so.

Home machines can be purchased refurbished as low as $600, and new as high as $3k. Neither machine comes even close to expectations. Many suffer mechanical issues and are abandoned by the buyer. They sit for years, sometimes with the last spent coffee puck still in the machine. Commercial super-auto's run around $6k and up. And trust us all, you would still not be satisfied with their product... the machine nor the coffee. Go to a new car dealership, a hospital cafeteria, or any other location where you can put money into a machine and "order up a cappuccino." It's more like poorly flavored coffee-milk. I'd rather see a beginner buy a Rancilia Silvia single boiler machine and a Rocky grinder, than pay as much for a machine from William Sonoma or a department store.

If I had the opportunity to help someone contemplating this purchase, it would be to take them to a few great espresso bars, and let them taste their favorite drinks as done by certified baristas, on good equipment. After establishing a "baseline" for properly brewed coffee, we could hit a few places that have super-auto's set up and try their output. You'll sometimes find the specialty stores offer that, but it's rare, as the machines require both knowledgable operators "and" monitoring. They really aren't as "super-auto" as you might think. And that's the reason the output tastes so commercial and cheap. In summary, you'll spend as much time maintaining and monitoring a super-auto as you will your single-boiler system. There are no shortcuts.

 

[alsterling]

Seattle Coffee Gear is OK.....

Randy.... I visited Seattle Coffee Gear just after they first opened. At least they demonstrate their product, and the owners are very up-front about expectations. I don't know any other showroom setup like that here in SoCal. For best showrooms, I'd think Chris Coffee and Whole Latte Love in upstate NY would be a good example of moving people through all options. But in my humble opinion, and after one parts with their money.... I'd say that a buyer will soon realize that they aren't going to give "espresso parties" for all of their friends, and the machine is basically going to be for their household only. They'll either move on to a competent espresso setup, or slowly lose interest in their "espresso box."

 

[alphawave7]

Randy.... I visited Seattle Coffee Gear just after they first opened. At least they demonstrate their product, and the owners are very up-front about expectations. I don't know any other showroom setup like that here in SoCal. For best showrooms, I'd think Chris Coffee and Whole Latte Love in upstate NY would be a good example of moving people through all options. But in my humble opinion, and after one parts with their money.... I'd say that a buyer will soon realize that they aren't going to give "espresso parties" for all of their friends, and the machine is basically going to be for their household only. They'll either move on to a competent espresso setup, or slowly lose interest in their "espresso box."

The frustrating part is I can teach how to pull better tasting shots on a $100 gutted-PF Starbucks Barista (Saeco) using a great grinder, but folks would rather spend mega-$$$ and press several buttons!
BTW, are the LelIt setups still in the running for low-cost/high quality gear, or have they been challenged by anyone else lately..I'm not up to date on this starter range anymore?

 

[alsterling]

Alpha... I missed something... what are the "LelIt setups?" (confused in SoCal :decaf: )

 

[alphawave7]

Sorry Al..I must've mistyped yet again! Le Lit, or is it LeLit (one word)?
Le'Lit Espresso and Cappuccino Machines at 1st-line Equipment, LLC
Le'Lit PL53 Stepless Espresso Coffee Grinders at 1st-line Equipment, LLC

The 041 paired with a 53 was recently considered the lowest-end 'acceptable shot' combo one could get new...was wondering if anyone had any leads to other contenders in this lowest area.

 

[alsterling]

I'm clueless about the Le Lit. I'll have to ck' out 1st-Line. Personally, I'm a big believer in just jumping up to an HX machine like the Expobar and a Macap stepless doser grinder. I still use my Gaggia MDF grinder, but only for drip grind.

 

[friedcoffee]

Hi Guys,
I know that Super Automatics are bad and should be banned for life, but I would like one because in the morning I dont feel like standing at the counter half awake making my coffee, also when my friends are around I want to be entertaining and not trying to make coffee's for everyone.

Now my question is which one is more quiet and which on is better?\

Thanks
Anthony

I do agree with this clause as just waking up in the morning standing half awake making a perfect cup of coffee....It sounds so comfortable having a perfect cup of coffee without doing much in the morning. There is one machine that is in launch process called Auroma and it will learn your coffee preferences over time and will give you a delicious cup automatically. Anyone heard about it?